Tony Scott: 0:13

Welcome to T the Jay Franze Show, a behind-the-curtain look at the entertainment industry, with insights you can't pay for and stories you've never heard. Now here's your host, J jay Franze.

Jay Franze: 0:42

Well, hello, hello, hello and welcome to the show. I am Jay Franze and this is your backstage pass to the entertainment industry. This week we get to talk with a country music recording artist that's keeping the honky-tonks alive. We get to talk with Avery Glenn Crabtree. We'll talk to him about the passion that he brings to his performances, what the honky-tonk scene is like these days, and we'll discuss how starting in bluegrass has shaped his performances. Now, avery, he's an absolutely amazing recording artist and I cannot wait to talk with him tonight. So if you would like to join in, comment or fire off any questions, please head over to jfranzycom. Now let's get started. Avery, my friend, how are you?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 1:26

How are you? I'm doing so good, Jay, that I got to sit on both hands just to keep away from everybody, there you go.

Jay Franze: 1:34

You're known for your passion, so how do you channel such passion into your performances?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 1:39

oh, wow, that's a good question. Well, I am what you call what some people call an empath. I kind of tap into things like if I'm singing a sad song, I'm gonna think of something really sad and tap into things Like, if I'm singing a sad song, I'm going to think of something really sad and tap into that. Or if I'm singing, let's say, a sexy song, like a Prince song or whatever, I'll turn myself on some way. You know you close your eyes, use your imagination and just tap into it and then like, if I'm an aggressive, kiss my butt type song, gotta get that kind of attitude. Hey, really, you know singers really are actors. You know you got to kind of act right. Most you know the actors, they'll they get into character, getting character and stay in character. They don't want to be around people. They don't want to be around them.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 2:34

Kind of tap into that level of insanity. I don't know. I just close my eyes and just let it out. You know, some people go to the gym, some people run, some people booze it up or whatever.

Jay Franze: 2:53

I sing, that's my stress reliever, that's I let it all out well, I've had a chance to see you perform a couple times now and the real aggressive songs are the ones that I seem to relate to. I mean, you get up there and you just seem to lay it all out on the line when you're playing those songs. Do any of those songs hold some sort of special place to you?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 3:14

Wow, that's a great question, J jay. Every song I sing has a special place. There's some songs like I used to play in an older band we did more like top 40 stuff and I can't sing a song if I can't feel that song, if I can't relate to that song in some way, I can't really do it. You can't really. You can sing them, but as far as digging deep, like we were just talking about it, don't really catch traction with me. I've got to feel that song. I tell you what, have you heard? The new Red Clothes? They're awesome. They've got that raw, that passion feel that I really like. There's a song called Wondering why. I love that that kind of feel. So songs like that I can really tap into. Most people have never heard them before and I'm kind of real partial to not really the popular songs. I mean, I'll do them if people want to hear them. But I like the B side of things. I like deep cuts, songs people should be listening to instead of, you know, top 40, force-fed stuff.

Jay Franze: 4:19

So what is it that you like most about being on stage?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 4:23

Playing with the band, whether there's five or 500 or 1,000 people out front of you, it's like a fellowship. That's what I really get off on is like hearing the kick the bass harmony. You know, it's like I ain't got the right words, I'm not learned. It's a fellowship with the musicians I'm on stage with right that connection that that's you're talking about.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 4:49

Like connecting with a song. If I buy myself an acoustic, it's okay. But like when you get a band up there and you're communicating musically and everybody's in sync, you know, you all do the same thing without thinking about it. Putting a passionate song by myself, it's okay, but when you got like a great guitar player, great bass player, drummer, and it all comes together, man, you can just let it go. You know what I mean and just feed off that that's what I really like. Actually I'm a guitar player first, singer second. It builds up to me. I wanted to be richie sambora growing up. I didn't want to be a front man, you know. I wanted to be play lead guitar and sing harmony, you know. But I guess they just stuck me up front because I'm full of crap and talk to people.

Jay Franze: 5:40

Well, it's lucky for us that you're the front man. I mean, your voice is very unique. It's got that gravelly feel to it. It's got a lot of power and emotion behind it.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 5:59

So I think we'd be at a loss if we didn't have that. Thank you, thank you very much. And your band, your band is incredible. My father played bluegrass music, oh yeah, and you know there's phenomenal musicians top to bottom, left, right and bluegrass. So, like I learned a long time ago to surround myself with superior musicians, people that are better than me, that's how you grow, so you get better, in my opinion.

Jay Franze: 6:14

Oh no, you're. You're absolutely right. I mean, that's in any industry you surround yourself with people who are better than you are and you're going to do nothing but grow. With that said, I mean, in having a band like that, what kind of challenges do you guys face?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 6:28

Oh gosh, scheduling. Cause they're great musicians and I like for my guys that play with me to play with other people. That's how you grow. Also, you learn and people have different feels, different ways to do songs, different tones, different styles of playing, and usually those caliber musicians are in demand. So scheduling is really the hardest thing, because these guys go back and forth to Nashville. They're busy.

Jay Franze: 7:03

So you've really got to stay on top of the scheduling. That makes perfect sense. I mean, like you said, they do travel back and forth to Nashville but that's because they're so sought after. I mean, they're very, very good musicians. So the fact that you're able to surround yourself with musicians of that caliber and you're able to play some of the venues that you play, even some of the crowds, I mean you get in front of some some pretty passionate crowds.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 7:25

They'll let you know real quick if they like it or not, which is fine. I enjoy that. I like honesty. There's too many people telling way too many musicians what they think they want to hear, instead of being straight up.

Jay Franze: 7:40

So when you're playing some of these, let's say, smaller venues, do you have any interactions with the audience? That are just insane, oh God.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 7:50

Let me tell you this quick story. Yeah, please. And I feel awful after this. I did and like one of my pet peeves is someone grabbing my mic stand. Nine times I've tanned electric in the places of that good, so it's going to shock your lips off for one, and then I want to keep my teeth. You know.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 8:08

So this older middle eastern gentleman was there. This was in Austin City, this was Austin City, and he grabs the base of a mic stand. He kind of shakes it. He's grinning from ear to ear Like, hey, buddy, don't grab my mic stand. He does it again. He shakes it. I said, buddy, and I told you once if you grab my mic stand again, I'm going to kick your teeth out with my boots, and I would have. So kick your teeth out my boots and I would have. So he goes to grab it again, son, I go, and then his family comes running up, just running up.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 8:39

I'm thinking he's just been an asshole, you know. I said, oh, I'm so sorry he doesn't speak any english, but he really, really loves your music. The guy was just showing his appreciation for the music and then there I was, getting ready to kick his teeth out the heel of my boot and I felt awful and I cussed him. Of course he couldn't understand what I was saying, but then I felt bad. I felt awful Because his family was scared to death. There they are around a bunch of rednecks For one, and then and then. But he was really loving my music. He didn't know how to speak to me so he just was hey, I love your music, you know. Hey, right, and there I was threatening him. He had no idea. Glad, she thought, oh, and another little another. I guess I got a lot of these. Oh, please, we were playing one night and my drummer, don parker awesome drummer, don's great, been with me for a lot of years.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 9:30

Well, this guy wanted to play drums. He comes up to me and he's like I don't play drums, they're my drums. I can't say yeah or nay, you know, of course he goes to donnie. I was like I don't know if I want this guy to play or not, but I'll let him if you want him to know they're your drums. So I'd rather he not. Well, this guy's pacing back and forth like darth maul and a menace right stage because watching him Now the drummer is usually in it. He's not paying attention. You know he's playing. All of a sudden this guy makes a leap to the stage and goes to make one more leap up to the drum riser. I don't know what he's going to do to Donnie. Well, I catch him by the back of his collar and just sling him down the floor. You never know with people.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 10:11

Hey, I've seen people at classy joints a place called the Racquet Club in Lexington, a really classy place and this guy walks up to another fellow and just pops him in the face with a wine glass. The stem from the wine glass goes into his jugular and blood just squirts like 10 feet. I've never seen anything like this before. I mean blood's everywhere. Everybody's standing around. I just put my guitar down and call an ambulance. I mean, you see, all kinds of stuff, some of the wildest stuff, the harshest, meanest stuff I've seen have been in classy places Come from the nicer places.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 10:51

Yeah, and then, like the honky tonk, seedy looking joints, you know, had more fun. People are nice. It's weird, it's different.

Jay Franze: 11:01

Well, you mentioned that I've seen you play at a couple of the honky tonks. I've seen you most recently over at Austin City Saloon, which was an amazing place. It's the first time I've ever been there. It was really cool. I've also seen you over at the Tipsy Cow Good old place. They're both really cool, but the crowd looks like it would be a rough crowd. But they're really not. I mean, they're as nice as can be. I'm sure they can get rough.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 11:24

It really depends on what, I guess, what kind of vibe you're putting out on stage really you're putting out on stage really. You can control what's going on, the ambience of a room, really, by what kind of music you're playing and what kind of attitude you really have. If people are paying attention, subconsciously, you can affect them.

Jay Franze: 11:49

Well, I think that's a good point. I mean, some of these honky-tonks are pretty rough in nature or can be pretty rough in nature, but when you get on stage, you have a presence to you and you play music that not only do they want to hear, but you play a wide range of music and it just keeps them involved and they get up and they dance or they put their fists in the air and rock out. So I mean, it seems to have a vibe to it and I think that vibe comes from, like you said, you being on stage, almost directing the way that crowd reacts, and I think that the behavior of the crowd comes from you, not from them.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 12:27

You nailed it, that's it, jay, what kind of mood you want them in, you know. And one thing that I do, that I think it's a necessity, and I try to cater to the women in the club more so than the men in the sense of the women really dictate the night, because if they're dancing and having a good time, the women are open and having fun. It's going to make for a great night. And one thing that I try to do is I always say if you want to go to a concert or see a rock star, you go to Rupp Arena, right. If you want to have a good time and a party, come see me at a club.

Jay Franze: 13:10

Well, to be fair, I mean you are a star and you are an amazing performer, singer, guitar player, all that stuff. However, I see your point and I do. I go to a lot of shows. I get to go to the arena shows, to the honky tonk shows and anything in between, and I would personally, most cases, prefer to be at the honky tonk. It just is something that you feel like you're involved in the performance. It's personal Right.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 13:37

You're approachable. One thing I do a little different than most I don't use set lists. For one I have ADD real bad. I won't go by it because I'll hit some kind of vibe. They're in a Prince vibe or they're in a 90s country vibe. So if you go by a set list it gets mundane and they can look at their watch and, oh, they're gonna play this next and, like the type of musicians that I hire to play with me, they're so good that they're going to get bored and a bored musician will get drunk on and just the other night you were on stage and I noticed there's no set list, there's nothing you guys are referencing, but you would start playing and then the band would just jump in.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 14:20

I mean, they have no idea what you're going to play next, not a clue, I mean now my drummer, donnie's been with me so long that he can tell right before we start what I'm noodling on, you know, my guitar of what we're getting ready to do. He can tell One thing that he has learned from me is my body language. Pay attention and control the stage by just my body language. And you know that makes it fun for all of us on stage Because it gets you know it gets playing the same stuff over and over. It gets boring. Shoot, we might even make up a song, you know it just keeps it fun. I believe if we're having fun me and the band if we're having fun, that crowd's going to have fun.

Jay Franze: 15:05

Well, you play that aggressive, honky-tonking country music, but the other night you even played Stevie Wonder and then followed with Metallica. So I mean, you do have the ability to just pull anything out, and it goes back to the talent of your musicians that they're able to just follow along with whatever you do.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 15:23

Yeah.

Jay Franze: 15:24

Yeah, so I mean with that said, I mean you've been playing for a long time and you've got these musicians who are able to read your body language. How has the band in the scene changed over the time that you've been performing?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 15:39

Oh, wow, oh, that's a great question, jay. I didn't expect you to ask me all these good questions. Well, for one thing, the bars have changed, the clubs have changed, in a sense of back. When I started playing full-time oh, 97, 98, you had house bands. There's no house bands anymore and you could go out almost any night of the week and hear a phenomenal house band. These guys blow you away Nowadays. Okay, I had a guy. He said well, I can pay you this if you'll bring a crowd. I said hey, buddy, it's not my job to bring a crowd, it's my job to keep the crowd. You have me, that's cool. People come, but it's my job to keep them there.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 16:26

And it's like these clubs have left it solely dependent on the artists to do all the advertising, bring in the people, and it's like it's really not supposed to be that way. They're supposed to have a crowd and I'm supposed to keep them there. Now, don't get me wrong. There are clubs, you know TFT. They do a lot of their own advertising. Scotty, he does a great job of that. A lot of times I don't even have to make an ad, I just share it or he'll send me the pictures to post. That's a big help. That's a big help. And clubs don't pay like they used to. Back in the late 90s, those places they had lines at the door, no matter who's playing there. People have changed. I guess I don't know if it's a younger crowd. I'll look out now on stage and I can see people on their phones some musicians and artists, I've noticed they expect people to sit and listen to everything they're doing instead of talking. People are going to talk. People are going to text.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 17:32

You just have to make them make them listen to you, call them out you know, some people expect just to sit there and sing and if you don't keep their attention, they're going to talk or do something else. And it goes back to what I was saying earlier about it's a party, whether a dj playing, whether it's a band playing. So I think it's kind of a whether it's a DJ playing, whether it's a band playing. So I think it's kind of presumptuous or arrogant to think that, hey, I'm here, you have to listen to me. I'm this. You know it's a party.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 18:05

You know I don't even get the words half right most of the time, so you know it's just a good time. Or I might try a song, I don't really know, but they want to hear it, it's a good time. That's what they come there to forget stuff and enjoy themselves, maybe hook up or get their buzz on or whatever, and so it's like it's really a party, basically. And it would be arrogant of me to think that, hey, I'm the man you need to sit and not talk and listen to what I'm saying all the time.

Jay Franze: 18:36

Well, it goes back to what you were saying earlier. I mean, it's the club's or the honky talker, the venue's job to get the people in the door. It's your job to keep them in the door. So you need to be able to engage them. So, if you don't want them on the phone, do something that's going to cause them not to be on the phone.

Jay Franze: 18:51

Either get them on the dance, floor or get them involved, tell them a joke, do something. Yeah Right, you mentioned something earlier that I want to circle back to, and that's the relationship between you and the GM of the Honky Tonk, or the owner of the Honky Tonk. Is it your style that helps you with the relationships with the bar owners, or is it the relationship with the bar owners that help you deliver your style?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 19:17

wow, that's another great question. Are some, uh, managers or bar owners, stuff, that kind of limit you and what you do, all top 40 or or this, or they try to control who you get on stage, or, and there are some people that's all uh, like tipsy scott, tipsy cow buddy of mine played football against him in 1994, you know and like. But like he is for the artist in the sense of he lets you do what you do on stage instead of catering mainly to the crowd because you can't satisfy everybody. You know this. Right, he caters to the crowd because you can't satisfy everybody. You know this. He caters to the artists. He's not the only one. I'm just using him for an example and he frees me up to not have in the back of my head oop, I better not do this, the bar owner might not like it. He lets artists be free to do what they do.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 20:10

When you can not think about what you're doing and let it come out naturally. That's where it's at. People are like you did this. I'm like oh, I did, didn't I? I didn't even think about it. That kind of freedom makes a big difference. If you've got a good entertainer up there and they're not thinking about am I going to offend someone? Or a bar manager's probably not going to like this or whatever.

Jay Franze: 20:36

Then, it frees them up to be artistic. Well, let's go back to your performing for a second because, as I mentioned earlier, you have a wide range of musical styles that you bring into your show, even though it's a country rock feel. But with that said, with all those different genres, who are the artists that have influenced you along the way? Oh wow.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 21:00

Well, growing up, my dad, I have three other brothers that play and sing. We started off mainly bluegrass for the harmony. You know, my dad would take us on trips and stuff and he would say you know every, you sing this part. You know, donovan, you sing this part, chester Ray, you sing this part, lawrence, you sing this part. We would have like four-part harmony. Everywhere we went we were getting groomed and didn't know it, you know. And my dad was pretty hardcore when it came to bluegrass, gospel, waylon and George Jones, which is great. But my mom okay, my mother, bless her heart, she's awesome. My mother, she loves Motown music. She's from North Carolina. She is from a place called Robinson County, north Carolina, which is where she is full-blooded Native American. She's Lumbee Indian. She has like 13 brothers and sisters, you know, going down there every summer they listen to. She would feed me stuff like Otis Redding, solomon Burke, tina Turner, stuff like that. And don't tell your dad I give you this stuff. So really, my influence, man, that's a great question, so many.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 22:13

First and foremost, I'm a huge Elvis fanatic. I've been my whole life, ever since I was little. I always tell people I was Elvis for Incarnate, because when he died three months later. I was born in 77. So like I love Elvis, I like all Elvis. From early 50s Elvis to 70s, bloated velvet Elvis. You know, I like it all. Elvis controlled the whole. He might have a 30 piece band up there. He controlled every musician on that stage and they watched him like a hawk. So I kind of stole that from him. In a sense he was a stage general, elvis was, and I love that. So first and foremost Elvis. Now see, there's two different ones. There's vocally influenced and there's guitar influenced Guitar wise. Let's see, I started off being a Jimi Hendrix Clapton guy. Then I got a little older and got into Jerry Reed chicken picking. Well, james Burton was a chicken picker. So there's so many influences. That's a hard question, jay.

Jay Franze: 23:29

I am a melange of artists. You seem to be a sponge and just take it all in.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 23:33

If it comes from the heart, I like it. Billy joe shaver in the 70s wrote all of waylon jennings hits. Now, fast forward. He had a son named eddie shaver who was phenomenal guitar player, this guy. He passed away in 99. He was my guitar hero forever and I tried to copy everything he did when he passed away. I was, he was my guitar hero forever and I tried to copy everything he did. When he passed away, I was like wow. To put it short, he was more of a Stevie Ray Vaughan, derek Trucks and Jerry Reed had a baby and he would do the chicken picking and do the blue stuff. And so the only person that played kind of hybrid style, which I play a hybrid style where you don't really use a pick but you also use your middle finger too. He did a hybrid style.

Jay Franze: 24:21

The other guy I saw do a hybrid style was brad paisley oh yeah, and people don't realize how good of a guitar player he is oh yeah, he is phenomenal and his, his tone.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 24:33

I'm a tone hound so I like that tone. So Paisley's kind of like my guitar, who I'm copying stuff after now, and he's one of the very few you know big artists that still do instrumentals. I love instrumentals. I can sit and listen to instrumentals and not even sing a word. So to boil it all down, of course, george Jones, marty Raven from Shenandoah, elvis Presley, otis Redding, travis Tritt put all those guys together and you got my vocals.

Jay Franze: 25:05

That's funny. You mentioned Travis Tritt there. I had a chance to work with Travis Tritt a couple times in the studio and I can see a similarity between the two of you the way that he approaches his music. It was Emerald Studios in Nashville and I was sitting in there setting up the studio getting ready for everybody to come in. And he came in about an hour or so before everybody else, and not only did he remember me from an event at Sony a few years before that, he called me by name, he came in, asked me for a place to sit down and he goes I just need a quiet place to write a song. I said what do you mean? Write a song? He goes the song we're going to perform today. I got to go write it. So I was like, okay. So he went in the other room and he wrote the song.

Jay Franze: 25:45

I get everything set up, the musicians show up. The lead session musician was there. Travis comes out, puts his leg up on a chair, puts a guitar on his knee, starts playing the song. The lead session guy picks up a piece of paper, charts it out, hands it to me. I make copies, I hand it to the musicians. They go in the room. Three and a half minutes later, the song's done. Ain't that something? It was just amazing.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 26:07

I mean everything but vocals I never knew that, I never knew that and I never knew that.

Jay Franze: 26:10

And that was for the song Falcon Fever, which was the theme song for the Atlanta Falcons.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 26:15

I think that's the song.

Jay Franze: 26:16

Very cool. But you mentioned something about your dad there being heavily into bluegrass and kind of grooming you guys in harmony parts and all of that and that's pretty impressive. We had Jason Hale on the show a few months ago and Jason's your bass player and I went to see Jason a few weeks back play at Farm Jam, the Bluegrass Festival. Everybody that got up there was technically fantastic, just amazing, and I think that ability to play that well is probably what's given you the ability to just take on any musical style that comes your way.

Jay Franze: 26:55

I mean you are a true musician. You get up there and you're able to pick up the guitar, play any song and just make it your own. So do you feel like that bluegrass foundation has given you that foundation of being able to perform all of these songs like you do? Absolutely.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 27:14

Absolutely, absolutely Bluegrass. Like growing up when I was younger, I didn't realize how complex it really is and how disciplined it really is. I mean these guys that do bluegrass, let's say like Doyle Lawson and Quicksilver or JD Crowe. These guys sound better live than they do on the album.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 27:33

Oh yeah, and sometimes you can't even tell it's live. I mean it's like they're so disciplined and so on, point. I mean they're not flat, they're not sharp, they're perfect. I mean it's like it's crazy, yeah, and that kind of discipline. And like my dad was a big banjo player, there's so many complex things that come together with banjo. It sounds simple but it's not. And most of the time they mix it themselves on stage. They will have one microphone. This guy will be this far back. This guy will be here Bluegrass to me.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 28:11

I know some people might think it's simple, but it's very not. I mean these, some of the greatest players to ever play a guitar has started off playing bluegrass music and I'm thankful to be to cut my teeth on that. You know to learn that because rhythm, rhythm. I've heard people ask the question which one do you think is more important, lead guitar or rhythm guitar? And it's rhythm all day long, because if you don't have the rhythm or that solid foundation, you can be the best guitar player and singer in the world. It don't mean nothing if it's off. And I go back to Jason. You know Jason has bluegrass roots but Jason plays everything he can go from Motown funk, solid, and that's one reason I hire guys like him it's less work for me. I'm a little, just be a little greedy there.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 29:04

Yeah, I don't have to do as much, I can kind of just not even think about it. And one thing I like about Bluegrass besides the musician part of it is the vocals. Voc vocals are just perfection, like dole awesome. If you sing with dole, awesome, you gotta be awesome, you know it.

Jay Franze: 29:24

Just, it runs a tight ship it's a unit and most of the time it's a family unit.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 29:30

It's usually a family that's up there. I like to have a band that's more of a family unit. So many bands that or? Or have the band tight enough where, like my drummer, donnie, will look at me and say, avery, and that sucks, you know. Or and I didn't like that, you know. They can be honest with you, you know, and, of course, if you're harboring some kind of itty-bitty, itty-little-bitty result it's going to fester and then you grow to where you don't really like that guy.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 30:00

But you're playing music with him. I did that once before in bands and I don't like that. Just go ahead and rip that Band-Aid off of me, because I'm going to do it with you. I'm going to say something that might hurt your feelings. It's not out of, but, like my dad growing up, he would hurt your feelings in front of people. If you were off, he'd let you know it real quick. But you know that's what you expect Not perfection, but expect the endeavor to be perfect. You're not going to be, instead of just half-assing it. You know there's no half-assing bluegrass.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 30:39

There is a great documentary out now on HBO Max called Trax T-R-A-X. It's about that studio, memphis, that popped out Sam and Dave oldest ready. There were country bumpkins putting out Motown music and that passion, that raw. I really got off on that. No matter what I'm going to do, jay, I'm going to do it with my heart wide open. And you know, like, like you know, when you're on stage singing in front of people even talking in front of people you feel vulnerable, you are vulnerable. It's like you ripped your chest open to show all these vulnerable parts and it's hard to do. People are going to rip it out or make fun of you or say it's bad. So what I started doing, I don't play for the people out in the crowd. Really I don't. I don't care Because you out in the crowd, really I don't. I don't care Because you're not going to satisfy everybody. If you play for you yourself, you can't go wrong. So if you just satisfy yourself, if people like it, that's fine. If they don't, they can leave.

Jay Franze: 31:45

Well, that's what art's all about. So I mean, art is supposed to please you. You do the art for yourself, and then the people who enjoy your art are the ones that you attract. You know, that's the way I'm going back to travis trip.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 31:56

Yeah, travis trip was a huge influence on me, as you can probably tell my vocals when he first came out. The only thing that was out then was the cowboy hat music. There's nothing wrong with, I mean, like you know, you got your, you got your Clay Walker, but man, he come out, him, and Marty Stewart, the no Hats Tour. This guy was rock and roll, playing country music. Oh man, that really resonated with me. And he was coming out leather pants man Playing rock and roll with a country slang, which now it's. You know well, I guess it's not right now. It's more hip-hop. Now Hip-hop, more like rap-infused country Right?

Jay Franze: 32:38

Well, you mentioned Travis Tritt again. There, I mean, he's got that same attitude that you have when he's on stage. He's got that you know, tough attitude, the aggressive attitude. We had Scotty Simpson on the show. Scotty Simpson plays bass, or played bass for Travis Tritt, so I mean he was on here telling some pretty amazing stories too. It's pretty cool to hear everybody's different viewpoint on one person. Like I worked with them, scotty played for him. You know he influenced you and to hear everybody's different version of the same person is kind of cool.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 33:09

A different version of the same person. Oh, I'm going to steal that, jay, you're exactly right. You're exactly right.

Jay Franze: 33:17

We keep talking about the industry and how things have changed. I know when you play these honky-tonks I mean it's like stepping back in time sometimes. I mean even Austin City Saloon the other night it felt like it was stepping back at least 10, 15 years in time. So normally we talk about technology changing and stuff, but you mentioned the the industry changing, how bar owners are expecting you to market shows for them these days. So do you feel like there's some sort of pressure on you to develop a brand and start working social media?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 33:51

yes, yes, very much. So a lot of people they got the money to pay somebody to the social media or you know. Growing up, you know I'll be 47 this year, so I didn't have a smartphone till 2010, right, maybe later. So, like, so I had to really dig in and do it my own and, and a lot of times I'll get home, I'll just put my phone up. I'll see it for the whole weekend. So to me, it's hard to get on there and do stuff because it makes me feel pretentious. I know some people told me to get over that because it's not about that. But to get on and make a video of me singing and hey, listen to me, this is all about me I'm like, let me do that. It's hard for me to do that and not feel pretentious, right, so it's hard. Yeah, there is a big push for that to get on there and, like, I spent, like, my YouTube channel. I didn't know how to maneuver YouTube. I, you know, I've already used a computer, me and the wife, we got coffee going on weekends, so we stayed up the whole weekend and tried to figure out how to hashtag and maneuver YouTube to be able to post it and stuff. And man, I tell you what, once you get the hang of something, boom, it changes. It's totally different. Something else has come out Now.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 35:18

I love TikTok. As many other Americans, I enjoy TikTok watching TikTok more than posting on TikTok. But I think TikTok is a real good platform for people nowadays because it's short and sweet, mostly Hit the highlights. Yeah, yeah, get the highlights and they teach you stuff on TikTok, how to use it, so some OG ignorant ass like me can get on there and somewhat learn how to use it. But there is a big push for learning how to do it. It feels like someone told me the other day who was it? A guy named Bill who owns Maiden City in Paris, which is a great place. He's like Avery.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 35:59

You got to put yourself out there on social media and I was telling him I feel pretentious when I do. You know, playing a show is different. It's my job, it's getting paid to do this, but to get on there, I don't know. Hey, look at me. You know that's what I feel like, you know. But I've got to get out of that mentality. Back when I started, you made flyers. You made flyers and hung them up. Go all over town, hang them up. You know you remember all that stuff, but like now it's like I don't know, I need I need to really break out of that and but it's hard to do. Also, when you're home and the kids are running around and you got noise in the background, you can't really I don't know, I'm making excuses.

Jay Franze: 36:45

Aren't I, Jay? I got to tell it to you straight. That's what it sounds like there, buddy.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 36:49

Yeah, yeah, I got to start doing more on there.

Jay Franze: 36:57

That's all right. So if we take your social media and the people who do follow you, you have a core group of people who follow you and you have a core group of people who come see you perform. What do you hope that these people take away from seeing you? You ask great questions brother.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 37:09

I appreciate it. You ask great questions, brother. I appreciate it. You ask great questions. That's a what I hope they take away from seeing me. I hope they're blown away. I want to touch them in the sense of. I'll tell you an example. I was playing a club one night and at the end of the night I did a gospel song. And something just hit me to do a gospel song, and I did, and of course there were some people who got mad at me for doing that. That don't belong here. You shouldn't be doing that. I'm like whatever, f off.

Tony Scott: 37:51

Walk.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 37:52

And then this old drunk dude, man looked half homeless, Sat there all night long. Listen to me, he didn't dance, he just sat there. This dude comes staggering up to me at the end of the night I'm wrapping up cables. He looked at me with tears in his eyes. Jay, he goes. Man, I just want to thank you for that song. I said what song? He said that gospel. He said my mom used to sing that song. He said I haven't thought of my mom in years and he was crying.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 38:19

And, man, that's affecting me right now. To touch somebody like that, To make them think of their mom, Because music to me. Like I could be driving down the road, listen to a song, start crying or get chills, you know, it just affects me that way. To affect someone that way means more to me. That one person, not that thousand people, but that one guy. That made him cry, you know, made him feel a certain way he ain't felt in years. Some old drunk. That meant more to me than singing, than the hottest girl come up to flash at me or whatever, or the money that was worth it for me.

Tony Scott: 39:03

That's what I hope they take away.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 39:05

If I touch them in that way, that is success for me.

Jay Franze: 39:11

That's awesome. I love that. All right, sir. Well, we do this thing here we call Unsung Heroes, where we take the moment to shine the light on somebody who works behind the scenes or somebody who may have supported you along the way. Do you have anybody you'd like to shine a little light on?

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 39:25

I got many. There's so many people out there, musicians in a way. Well know what? I'm gonna go with this? J My oldest brother I'm second oldest of four boys, but my oldest brother, donovan he played guitar before I did. He does not know this, he has no idea that he influenced me more than anybody really Growing up. You know, he would bring in Tres Hombres, zz Top or uh, uh, no, leonard Skinner or, uh, eric Clapton stuff and he would. He would set and play this stuff and when I was learning my chords my brother donovan would show me this stuff or slag guitar lick, or blues lick. He was a big robert johnson fan, big blues fan and, uh, if it wasn't for my brother donovan, I would not be at the level I am right now because he brought in the eagles, you know they able to check his song out. Wow, that's awesome. What is this? So, growing up with my brother Donovan which is a phenomenal singer in his own self, but he had enough sense not to do it for a living my brother Donovan probably would be one of my biggest heroes. That's awesome. And he has no idea. If I was a telly man he'd be like, ah, shut up, you know. Now I'm going to say your praises just a little bit here, J jay.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 40:57

What I like, what you're doing, you are doing music, not country, not metal, just music in general. Whatever and whoever brings it, you bring it on. I like that because, like you're, the same way too. I like country music, I like metal or some rap, I like if it's good, you like it and you're you're not just doing country artists or blues or metal, you're doing all of it, like you have the oakridge boys. Then you had the five-figure dead punch, you know, just, I like that. I respect that a lot.

Jay Franze: 41:32

Well, thank you, I appreciate that.

Avery Glenn Crabtree: 41:33

Well, I'll tell you what. I'll leave you with this, my favorite quote by Ludwig von Beethoven. He said to play a wrong note is insignificant, but to play without passion is inexcusable.

Jay Franze: 41:48

A big thanks to Avery for taking the time to share his stories with us and, as always, thank you for taking the time to hang with me here. I really do appreciate it. If you know anybody that would appreciate hearing Avery's story or appreciate this episode, please be sure to pass it along. You can do that and find the links to everything mentioned episode 77. Thanks again for listening and I'll see you next week.

Tony Scott: 42:15

Thanks for listening to T the Jay Franze show. Make sure you visit us at jay franze... com follow, connect and say hello, okay.